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modding

Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
in Buda 5 Discussion
Greatings I would just like to say that the work done by Buda 5 is exceptional. I have done some B5 modding for klingon academy and would like to see what I can do with Iwar 2. Are there any polygon or point limits for the engine? Any type of polys Iwar doesn't like?

Thank You

Comments

  • MorteMorte Earthforce Officer
    First off, thanks for the complement :)
    I'll run you over a couple of basic rules for the engine:
    1) No section can have over 1000 polys (in practice this actually ends up about 800 max). This just means you have to divide your model into sections.
    2) EOC really doesn't like non-planar polygons. Sometimes they'll be fine, other times not.
    3) As far as poly limit on screen goes... well, that's more up to your hardware than the engine. I did hear a while back that theoretically the engine can support up to 1 million polygons on screen- but you'd need one hell of a computer to run it. In practice I have not come across any limit on the amount of polygons per ship (as long as it's divided into sections) or on screen.

    If you have any more questions, feel free to ask :)
  • Eddy the GreatEddy the Great Trainee
    Londo! you traiter. how could you betray KA.....j/k anyways thats cool in many ways i like this game because of the beam weopons,lds drive tons of stations and random encounters, also you can add new sounds without replacing others. its to bad that you cant add ships only replace. if only some one can make a game that has these games put together in one(starshatter,Klingon Academy, i-war2)
  • LogicSequenceLogicSequence Elite Ranger
    Re: modding

    [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Londo Mollari 2 [/i]
    [B]Greatings I would just like to say that the work done by Buda 5 is exceptional. I have done some B5 modding for klingon academy and would like to see what I can do with Iwar 2. Are there any polygon or point limits for the engine? Any type of polys Iwar doesn't like?

    Thank You [/B][/QUOTE]

    Welcome to the boards :) we had an influx of newcomers today! :) anyways, as morte said there are no poly limits persay, but here are some general rules:

    Iwar2 has a max "per section" limit of polygons, which morte mentioned. the actual limit is a tricky math problem :) so get this one, lol. Iwar2 splits all models into triangles on compile. so if your model is all 4-vertexed poly's, yer limit is about 800. all triangles, that number goes to about 1500. however most model sections are a mismatch of poly-vertexed polygons, so it ends up with a range limit ofr 750-850.

    Non-planar polygons are actually ok in Iwar 2.. they may look funny if they're EXTREMELY non-planar, but they won't cause any faults. (i'd reccomend spliting them into triangles tho.. but that's just me)

    Iwar2 will not accept 1 or 2 vertecies polygons, this will cause problems.

    Iwar2 doesn't like a lot of small polygons grouped close togther

    Iwar2 doesn't like internal angle polygons (post if u need a definition on that). It will try to make sense of them, but it can't, so they will show up... weird ;)

    models must be made in Lightwave 5.6 - 6.5 (5.6 format), textures .iff format in multiples of 32 x 32 pixels. (i.e. 64 x 64, 128 x 128, etc...).

    of course u need the converter and SDK

    and lastly.. read the SDK :) it has tons of information u'll find useful.
  • Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
    Thank you. Looking forward to see what I can do.
  • Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
    Have more questions. Does the game engine allow moving textures? (ie moving shadow textures or moving textures on the vorlon dreadnaught). Can animations be done such have the Petals of the vorlon fighter or transport opeing or closing when you go into faster than light travel? Do you guys have a generic ship template that allows you to try models in the game without weapons? I guess I like to get the high poly models to work in the game. I convert them to around 8000-10000 polys. If you guys are interested I've got a bunch of models working in KA that might be able to be converted to I-war 2. Such as Nadab's advanced whitestar. Don't know if I'll have time to learn all the rest but I would like to help if I can.

    Thanks
  • LogicSequenceLogicSequence Elite Ranger
    u can't simply convert other peopls files into lower poly files, thats copyright infringement and is illegal.. u can look at other 3d models for a reference, but u must model your own. Moving ship parts are controled by animation channels (READ the SDK). moving textures are not supported. all the templates u need are in the SDK. (AGAIN READ THE SDK! LOL) READ THE SDK READ THE SDK READ THE SDK. :)
  • Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
    I always contact the author of the model for permission to use it. Many authors also have a readme with their models saying you may use the model if you give full credit to the author and are not using the model for financial gain......which I always do. I still contact them anyway before I use their models to make sure its still OK. I try to maintain the quality of the author's work as much as the game engines will allow. And yes I've started to read the sdk
  • LogicSequenceLogicSequence Elite Ranger
    well i'm glad u contact them, but that's no help where buda 5 is concerned. all the models that are to be used for buda 5 must be your own models. all of them so far have been made by buda 5 modelers themselves, and those in the future must be as well ;). not only is it a matter of pride but also legallity.. sure u can ask permission, but even so, putting them in a publicized mod is something different. so to avoid any possible problems, they have to be made by buda 5 modelers. now like i said, using a 3d model as reference is fine, we do it all the time, they're much better than screenshots. hope that clears things up :)

    LoL and glad to see yer reading the SDK.. it's amazing what u can learn from manuals ;) hehe
  • Warlord IIWarlord II Earthforce Officer
    [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Eddy the Great [/i]
    [B]its too bad that you cant add ships only replace. [/B][/QUOTE]If you want your ship in I-War 2 campaign or instant action then you have to replace but you can add ships if you use scenarios (because you create ships in script and use whatever ini files you want).
  • Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
    Another newbie question. How do you look at the .pso files? Is there a way to get them back to lightwave files?

    Thanks
  • IndieIndie Moderator
    In a word: no.

    You can't convert them back. Its a one-way trip. Also, there is no pso viewer other than EOC of course.
  • Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
    hmmmm makes it kinda hard to see how the ships are set up
  • LogicSequenceLogicSequence Elite Ranger
    yes... in order to have the lightwave versions u must have the modeler's origional files...

    my suggestion is trial and error... u just have to try untill u get it right... :( sorry there's not more help.
  • Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
    Has anyone made a pictoral modding tutorial?
  • LogicSequenceLogicSequence Elite Ranger
    [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Londo Mollari 2 [/i]
    [B]Has anyone made a pictoral modding tutorial? [/B][/QUOTE]

    i'm not sure what you mean?
  • MorteMorte Earthforce Officer
    [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Londo Mollari 2 [/i]
    [B]Has anyone made a pictoral modding tutorial? [/B][/QUOTE]
    Sorry mate, I don't think there are any tutorials for IW2 modding in existance (at least none I know of). All I can suggest is to read the graphics sdk readme, and to post any questions here.
  • Londo Mollari 2Londo Mollari 2 Trainee
    What I mean is that since I can't look at how the lightwave objects are set up as their are none. I wondered if someone took screenshots of the setups in layout so I could see how the surfaces are named and the nulls are applied. This engine has many advantages over the Ka engine........ie the vorlon dreadnaught main beam animations....but it seems a bit confusing on how the models are setup in lightwave
  • LogicSequenceLogicSequence Elite Ranger
    [QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Londo Mollari 2 [/i]
    [B]What I mean is that since I can't look at how the lightwave objects are set up as their are none. I wondered if someone took screenshots of the setups in layout so I could see how the surfaces are named and the nulls are applied. This engine has many advantages over the Ka engine........ie the vorlon dreadnaught main beam animations....but it seems a bit confusing on how the models are setup in lightwave [/B][/QUOTE]


    unless you are applying a glow texture, it doesn't matter what the name of the texture surface is.... u can name it anything from generic_panels_y_axis to apples_oranges_and_big_ole_bannanas.... it really doesn't matter.

    Now as for how nulls are applied, i'm not sure what u mean... do u mean for an avatar setup? or a simsetup? remember in the simsetup you are only making nulls as weapons points and docking points, etc... etc... nulls in an avatar setup are usually just to help the modeler out in moving items or rotating items, etc...

    now as for animations like the vorlon dreadnaught main beams.. those are pretty advanced setups. and basically EOC was never designed to do such things, so we cheat our way around things to make it work... it's a complex setup.

    anyways, u have all the setup files in a mod. the .lws files are used by EOC, so they are all there.. granted u don't have the lightwave models that go with them, but u can still open them with lightwave.
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