Random ChaosActually Carefully-selected Order in disguise
The US has often had multiple parties. This year there are 5 parties plus 1 independent running for president. The problem is the structure of state voting systems combined with federal funding systems marginalizes any party that doesn't have a sizable chunck of the vote. This helps encourage a 2 party system.
And yes - there was a 3rd party - I believe it was the Whips? It was replaced by one of the present parties - the 3rd party existed while both the replacement and the original existed - and no - they didn't completely share ideologies. I am dredging this up from the bowels of my brain - it has been a long time since I have studied American history.
Well, theres been a number of parties in America's History. We have not always been a two-party nation. In fact, some of those parties were quite strong.
Back in the day, there were the Federalist and Anti-federalists (which faded off into obscurity and was replaced by the Whigs and the Anti-Masonics). That later turned into nearly six parties struggling for public attention, consisting of the Constitutional party, the Free Soil party, the Know-Nothing party, the Liberal party, and the more-or-less current Democrat and Republican parties. I believe that, up until the 30's or so, a number of strong third parties still existed, but I cannot back that up with any names.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by SpiritOne [/i]
[B]The NRA needs to get back to its roots and teach safety, not protection.
sorry, I kind of went off on a tangent there. [/B][/QUOTE]
SpiritOne , can I suggest that your letting your own negative experiences over ride your judgement? ND's are a major worry, but my experience with them has been that ironicly they seem to stalk "proffesionals" just as much as hobbists? The only person who I know who has shoot themselves was a police officer, and it was in his appartment after his shift he was unholstering his weapon and put a bullet into his leg.
I personally have both my handguns locked up when Im not arround, but when I am home I keep one somewhat handy why? because if Im attacked in my home, ILL BE DEAD BEFORE THE COPS GET THERE! I live in a rural area with about a 10 minute response time!
Then again, Im in the situation alot of gun owners are in, I dont have kids! there are no kids in my house EVER! the nearest kids in the family are my two youngest cousins who live over 200 miles away, when they come to town they stay at their sisters place, the house is usually locked up, and the guests I have over are people I know and trust well. Its part of that reason that I am not obsessed with people getting unotherized access while I am there. Because if somebody does get my handgun when its not in the safe, it means Im already dead!
I also grew up in an envrionment where there was a .22 and ammo in a locking gun case, and if I asked I could get the key easily, because it was needed to protect the various poltry that we were raising. The neighbors had a marlin 30/30 lever action stored fairly handy because coyotes kept going after the rabbits they raised.
In fact in rural environments, its fairly common to have weapons easily at hand, and accidental shootings are rare! as are homicides!
Ive got to ask SpiritOne, what was your firearms exposure before you entered the marines?
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Random Chaos [/i]
[B]
And yes - there was a 3rd party - I believe it was the Whips? It was replaced by one of the present parties - the 3rd party existed while both the replacement and the original existed - and no - they didn't completely share ideologies. I am dredging this up from the bowels of my brain - it has been a long time since I have studied American history. [/B][/QUOTE]
It was the whigs, they disintergrated in 1856 due to rivalries over a few issues, mainly however was the decision weather or not to include an anti slavery plank in the party platform, many elements of the whig party ended up being abosrbed into the Republican party in time to allow the Republican party to be a serious condender in the election of 1860.
My firearms exposure prior to the Marines was decent. My dad had(well still has) a colt 1911 gold cup .45. But it was always locked up when he wasnt using it. Its kind of strange really, how my dad has bought the NRA's crap. All the time I was growing up, that weapon was locked up. Now, even with my younger sisters in the house, its his home protection weapon. Why? Because his beloved NRA tells him he needs to protect himself. Keep in mind, he lives in a small town, in rural wisconsin about 4 blocks from the fire department and about a mile from the police station. I also had a .22 rifle that I was allowed to shoot when he took his rifle out. both of these weapons were just kept in a closet, not in a locked case, but that was an Ok thing to do in 1985, kids hadnt taken their rifles to school and mass murdered other kids in 1985.
Are there people who live in places remote enough that they could probably use a weapon to protect themselves? Yes, Im not saying there isnt, but a majority of people in this country arent even responsible enough to own a gun, much less use it defense of something. And where does that defensive posture get them? I read a story in one of my NRA magazines about a gun owner getting arrested because he tried to play vigilante at a convenience store robbery. Yeah, he killed the 2 suspects and kept them from stealing anything, but he did it in a convenience store, miles from his home, didnt have a concealed carry permit and there were a couple of children in the store. Now, Im not going to defend the two little punks who tried to rob it, but this guy did the wrong thing. And he is serving time for it while NRA lawyers try to get him out.
It comes to this. While I agree people should be allowed to own firearms, they MUST be educated on them. Its just plain irresponsible to not be. There are still too many accidental or un-intended shootings because people arent being smart.
A lot of this, is anger twords the NRA. They used to be a good organization, to teach the safe handling of weapons, and promote safe fun ownership. Can you even find the 4 safety rules on the NRA website? seriously. can you? its so burried in political bullshit right now, they arent even a centerpoint anymore.
fyi> the 4 safety rules are 4 generalized rules about safe handling a weapon originally adopted by the NRA and the military and is the basis on teaching safe weapon handling. As a rifle/pistol coach in the Marines, I expected every Marine expecting to shoot to know them by heart and recite them on command, or I wasnt taking them to the firing line.
always treat a weapon as if it were loaded
never point a weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot
keep your finger straight and off the trigger until you are ready to fire
keep the weapon on safe until you intend to fire
basic rules that many people seem to forget. my father included no matter how many times I say something about it. People use the excuse "Well I thought it was unloaded" or, "It just went off".
Let me tell you something, Ive only ever seen one weapon "just go off", it was an mp5 that was fired for several minutes straight, the barrel just got so hot it was cooking off the few rounds remaining in the magazine. All the shooter could do is hold the weapon in a safe direction for the remaining rounds.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by SpiritOne [/i]
[B]A lot of this, is anger twords the NRA. They used to be a good organization, to teach the safe handling of weapons, and promote safe fun ownership. Can you even find the 4 safety rules on the NRA website? seriously. can you? its so burried in political bullshit right now, they arent even a centerpoint anymore.[/B][/QUOTE]Yeah, basing on their website they have become pure political bullshit organization.
Instead of pushing guns to every hand their first priority should really be teaching safe and responsible gun owning.
BTW, actually there should be fifth rule also: [b]Always think before doing![/b]
After shooting you always clear your weapon by taking magazine out and pulling loading handle to clear chamber and fire "aimed" shot to air away from others and put safe on.
On one terrain training (or whats that english word) with blanks this one guy does it in this order: he pulls loading handle, removes magazine...
And next stop was central military hospital for treatment to prevent worse hearing impairment. (fortunately only that)
Comments
And yes - there was a 3rd party - I believe it was the Whips? It was replaced by one of the present parties - the 3rd party existed while both the replacement and the original existed - and no - they didn't completely share ideologies. I am dredging this up from the bowels of my brain - it has been a long time since I have studied American history.
Back in the day, there were the Federalist and Anti-federalists (which faded off into obscurity and was replaced by the Whigs and the Anti-Masonics). That later turned into nearly six parties struggling for public attention, consisting of the Constitutional party, the Free Soil party, the Know-Nothing party, the Liberal party, and the more-or-less current Democrat and Republican parties. I believe that, up until the 30's or so, a number of strong third parties still existed, but I cannot back that up with any names.
[B]The NRA needs to get back to its roots and teach safety, not protection.
sorry, I kind of went off on a tangent there. [/B][/QUOTE]
SpiritOne , can I suggest that your letting your own negative experiences over ride your judgement? ND's are a major worry, but my experience with them has been that ironicly they seem to stalk "proffesionals" just as much as hobbists? The only person who I know who has shoot themselves was a police officer, and it was in his appartment after his shift he was unholstering his weapon and put a bullet into his leg.
I personally have both my handguns locked up when Im not arround, but when I am home I keep one somewhat handy why? because if Im attacked in my home, ILL BE DEAD BEFORE THE COPS GET THERE! I live in a rural area with about a 10 minute response time!
Then again, Im in the situation alot of gun owners are in, I dont have kids! there are no kids in my house EVER! the nearest kids in the family are my two youngest cousins who live over 200 miles away, when they come to town they stay at their sisters place, the house is usually locked up, and the guests I have over are people I know and trust well. Its part of that reason that I am not obsessed with people getting unotherized access while I am there. Because if somebody does get my handgun when its not in the safe, it means Im already dead!
I also grew up in an envrionment where there was a .22 and ammo in a locking gun case, and if I asked I could get the key easily, because it was needed to protect the various poltry that we were raising. The neighbors had a marlin 30/30 lever action stored fairly handy because coyotes kept going after the rabbits they raised.
In fact in rural environments, its fairly common to have weapons easily at hand, and accidental shootings are rare! as are homicides!
Ive got to ask SpiritOne, what was your firearms exposure before you entered the marines?
[B]
And yes - there was a 3rd party - I believe it was the Whips? It was replaced by one of the present parties - the 3rd party existed while both the replacement and the original existed - and no - they didn't completely share ideologies. I am dredging this up from the bowels of my brain - it has been a long time since I have studied American history. [/B][/QUOTE]
It was the whigs, they disintergrated in 1856 due to rivalries over a few issues, mainly however was the decision weather or not to include an anti slavery plank in the party platform, many elements of the whig party ended up being abosrbed into the Republican party in time to allow the Republican party to be a serious condender in the election of 1860.
Are there people who live in places remote enough that they could probably use a weapon to protect themselves? Yes, Im not saying there isnt, but a majority of people in this country arent even responsible enough to own a gun, much less use it defense of something. And where does that defensive posture get them? I read a story in one of my NRA magazines about a gun owner getting arrested because he tried to play vigilante at a convenience store robbery. Yeah, he killed the 2 suspects and kept them from stealing anything, but he did it in a convenience store, miles from his home, didnt have a concealed carry permit and there were a couple of children in the store. Now, Im not going to defend the two little punks who tried to rob it, but this guy did the wrong thing. And he is serving time for it while NRA lawyers try to get him out.
It comes to this. While I agree people should be allowed to own firearms, they MUST be educated on them. Its just plain irresponsible to not be. There are still too many accidental or un-intended shootings because people arent being smart.
A lot of this, is anger twords the NRA. They used to be a good organization, to teach the safe handling of weapons, and promote safe fun ownership. Can you even find the 4 safety rules on the NRA website? seriously. can you? its so burried in political bullshit right now, they arent even a centerpoint anymore.
fyi> the 4 safety rules are 4 generalized rules about safe handling a weapon originally adopted by the NRA and the military and is the basis on teaching safe weapon handling. As a rifle/pistol coach in the Marines, I expected every Marine expecting to shoot to know them by heart and recite them on command, or I wasnt taking them to the firing line.
always treat a weapon as if it were loaded
never point a weapon at anything you do not intend to shoot
keep your finger straight and off the trigger until you are ready to fire
keep the weapon on safe until you intend to fire
basic rules that many people seem to forget. my father included no matter how many times I say something about it. People use the excuse "Well I thought it was unloaded" or, "It just went off".
Let me tell you something, Ive only ever seen one weapon "just go off", it was an mp5 that was fired for several minutes straight, the barrel just got so hot it was cooking off the few rounds remaining in the magazine. All the shooter could do is hold the weapon in a safe direction for the remaining rounds.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by SpiritOne [/i]
[B]A lot of this, is anger twords the NRA. They used to be a good organization, to teach the safe handling of weapons, and promote safe fun ownership. Can you even find the 4 safety rules on the NRA website? seriously. can you? its so burried in political bullshit right now, they arent even a centerpoint anymore.[/B][/QUOTE]Yeah, basing on their website they have become pure political bullshit organization.
Instead of pushing guns to every hand their first priority should really be teaching safe and responsible gun owning.
BTW, actually there should be fifth rule also: [b]Always think before doing![/b]
After shooting you always clear your weapon by taking magazine out and pulling loading handle to clear chamber and fire "aimed" shot to air away from others and put safe on.
On one terrain training (or whats that english word) with blanks this one guy does it in this order: he pulls loading handle, removes magazine...
And next stop was central military hospital for treatment to prevent worse hearing impairment. (fortunately only that)
[img]http://cagle.com/news/nra/nragifs1/thompson.jpg[/img]
[img]http://cagle.com/news/AssaultWeaponsBan/images/chappatte.jpg[/img]