[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by A2597 [/i]
[B]NVidia isn't being dishonest?
Did they not sell the product as the first DX9 NVidia card?[/B][/QUOTE]
Absolutely. And it is. What's your point?
[QUOTE][B]it being DX( being the key selling point? Look at any review site that uses any DX9 test, beit Tomb Raider AOD, 3DMark, or the HL2 bench, and NVidia simply can't do it.[/B][/QUOTE]
Not at all true. NVIDIA certainly can do it; it's simply a question of being able to do it [i]well[/i]. So far, there's no concrete evidence that the current lack in performance is necessarily a hardware issue (though I agree that hardware issues are probably not innocent in this matter).
[QUOTE][B]its faulty advertsing[/B][/QUOTE]
Sorry, I don't agree. NVIDIA cards are certainly not the [i]best[/i] performers out there right now, but that doesn't make them impotent, and it doesn't mean the company is full of liars.
NVIDIA says that the current problem is primarily one of shader optimization, and that certainly seems consistent with all the benchmarks I've seen (all the significant performance losses seem to occur where shaders are involved). The big question is whether it's a problem with the hardware implementation or the software that drives it. NVIDIA seems to think it's in the software. Very well; let's give them a chance to prove it before condemning them as liars.
nVidia's biggest problem is that they're trying to do too much too fast in not enough time to do it right. What kept then behind for so long is them trying to get the .13 micron process done right. They had so many bad chips being produced that they had to spend more time getting it right....which led to the late release for the FX5200.
Now the FX cards ARE getting better. The lastest one is pretty much neck in neck with the the ATI 9800. What put ATI in the lead is that they got their "badass" card out first, and actually got their act together in their driver department. nVidia spent so much time getting the FX cards working that they're slipping in their driver department. (their drivers used to be their biggest selling point because they used to be so rock solid) For instance, they stopped including the macrovision decoder after 40.71 which means no software DVD playback if your video card has TV-out functionality. (that pissed off alot of people, me included)
Agreed. They're rushed, they were inconvenienced by TSMC, who told them -- incorrectly -- that they would have the .13 micron process ready in time, and now they're suffering from being second to market. That's a huge disadvantage when you're one of the two major companies, especially when your architecture differs greatly from the competition's. Read more about it [url="http://firingsquad.gamers.com/hardware/kirk_interview"]here[/url].
And yeah, those software DVD troubles are a spectacular omission on their part. I spent ages tracing them after downloading the first revision without them. Then, I googled it up one day, and I was just dumbfounded.
Biggles<font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by the_exile [/i]
[B]Didn't ATI try the same thing way back when? [/B][/QUOTE]
ATI tried to pull a fast one with quake 3 and a few other popular games a little while ago.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Sanfam [/i]
[B]I really, really want one!
And yeah, those software DVD troubles are a spectacular omission on their part. I spent ages tracing them after downloading the first revision without them. Then, I googled it up one day, and I was just dumbfounded. [/B][/QUOTE]
Yeah, I must've sent a dozen e-mails to nVidia about it. Still yet to recieve so much as a reply from them so I seriously doubt its gonna be fixed anytime soon. If this is the way they're going, then my GF3 will be my final nVidia card and I'll buy ATI from now on.
[QUOTE][i]Originally posted by Vertigo1 [/i]
[B]Yeah, I must've sent a dozen e-mails to nVidia about it. Still yet to recieve so much as a reply from them so I seriously doubt its gonna be fixed anytime soon. If this is the way they're going, then my GF3 will be my final nVidia card and I'll buy ATI from now on. [/B][/QUOTE]
Welcome to the Other Side. We've been waiting for you. :D
[QUOTE]Hey, wow, HL2 will be bundled with the Radeon 9800 XT!![/QUOTE]
Now I don't have to beg my family for a 256Mb card AND HL2 this Xmas! :eek:
Comments
[B]NVidia isn't being dishonest?
Did they not sell the product as the first DX9 NVidia card?[/B][/QUOTE]
Absolutely. And it is. What's your point?
[QUOTE][B]it being DX( being the key selling point? Look at any review site that uses any DX9 test, beit Tomb Raider AOD, 3DMark, or the HL2 bench, and NVidia simply can't do it.[/B][/QUOTE]
Not at all true. NVIDIA certainly can do it; it's simply a question of being able to do it [i]well[/i]. So far, there's no concrete evidence that the current lack in performance is necessarily a hardware issue (though I agree that hardware issues are probably not innocent in this matter).
[QUOTE][B]its faulty advertsing[/B][/QUOTE]
Sorry, I don't agree. NVIDIA cards are certainly not the [i]best[/i] performers out there right now, but that doesn't make them impotent, and it doesn't mean the company is full of liars.
NVIDIA says that the current problem is primarily one of shader optimization, and that certainly seems consistent with all the benchmarks I've seen (all the significant performance losses seem to occur where shaders are involved). The big question is whether it's a problem with the hardware implementation or the software that drives it. NVIDIA seems to think it's in the software. Very well; let's give them a chance to prove it before condemning them as liars.
Now the FX cards ARE getting better. The lastest one is pretty much neck in neck with the the ATI 9800. What put ATI in the lead is that they got their "badass" card out first, and actually got their act together in their driver department. nVidia spent so much time getting the FX cards working that they're slipping in their driver department. (their drivers used to be their biggest selling point because they used to be so rock solid) For instance, they stopped including the macrovision decoder after 40.71 which means no software DVD playback if your video card has TV-out functionality. (that pissed off alot of people, me included)
And yeah, those software DVD troubles are a spectacular omission on their part. I spent ages tracing them after downloading the first revision without them. Then, I googled it up one day, and I was just dumbfounded.
[B]Didn't ATI try the same thing way back when? [/B][/QUOTE]
ATI tried to pull a fast one with quake 3 and a few other popular games a little while ago.
[B]I really, really want one!
And yeah, those software DVD troubles are a spectacular omission on their part. I spent ages tracing them after downloading the first revision without them. Then, I googled it up one day, and I was just dumbfounded. [/B][/QUOTE]
Yeah, I must've sent a dozen e-mails to nVidia about it. Still yet to recieve so much as a reply from them so I seriously doubt its gonna be fixed anytime soon. If this is the way they're going, then my GF3 will be my final nVidia card and I'll buy ATI from now on.
[B]Yeah, I must've sent a dozen e-mails to nVidia about it. Still yet to recieve so much as a reply from them so I seriously doubt its gonna be fixed anytime soon. If this is the way they're going, then my GF3 will be my final nVidia card and I'll buy ATI from now on. [/B][/QUOTE]
Welcome to the Other Side. We've been waiting for you. :D
[QUOTE]Hey, wow, HL2 will be bundled with the Radeon 9800 XT!![/QUOTE]
Now I don't have to beg my family for a 256Mb card AND HL2 this Xmas! :eek: