Pluto isn't Planet X, that's for sure.
Planet X would have to have aproximately 7 times the mass of the Earth. Pluto has just about 2% of Earths mass. Even Pluto and charon together are still at only 3% of earths mass.
Maybe Quaoar is Planet X. We'll have to wait for data about it's size and mass.
Quaoar is half the mass of Pluto.. Planet X does not exist. All wobbles are acounted for. (But our sun *might* have a companion star. Look at [url="http://www.space.com"]www.space.com[/url] for Nemeses)
[quote]Originally posted by croxis:
[b]Quaoar is half the mass of Pluto.. [/b][/quote]
It has about half the radius of Pluto. I don't think they know anything about it's mass yet. This usually requires observing the object for an extended period of time.
Of course with this radius (even if it has a very high density) it probably won't have a verry high mass (nowhere near erths mass)
[quote]Originally posted by croxis:
[b]Planet X does not exist. All wobbles are acounted for. [/b][/quote]
You're sure about this? Pluto wasn't nearly enough to explain them, and we didn't discover toom many bodies with considerable mass since then. Not enough to account for Lowells missing 7 earth-masses. (as far as I know Lowells calculations weren't wrong)
Whoops! My Bad! It is radius! So far though it looks like it is just a KBO like Pluto. Many people whink that there may be a couple more Pluto sized objects out in the belt as well.
[quote]
You're sure about this? Pluto wasn't nearly enough to explain them, and we didn't discover toom many bodies with considerable mass since then. Not enough to account for Lowells missing 7 earth-masses. (as far as I know Lowells calculations weren't wrong)[/quote]
If this is the guy who I think it is... when he first made the claim he forgot to account for Earth's own wobble, so it made it look like everything else is off. I haven't been able to find a website though to back up his claim. As I said, if there is extra wobbling it may be from a companion red or brown dwarf that might be orbiting our sun about 1-3 ly out.
Look at [url="http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/"]http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/[/url] too
[This message has been edited by croxis (edited 10-10-2002).]
[quote]Originally posted by croxis:
[b]As I said, if there is extra wobbling it may be from a companion red or brown dwarf that might be orbiting our sun about 1-3 ly out.[/b][/quote]
1-3 ly ?
That's a tad far, and we should see some serious deviations in Proxima Centauri and the Alpha/Beta Centauri stars orbits... being they are generally 4 Light years distance...
Hmm, Well AC is below the orbital plane of the planets, and I assume such a star would also be on the same plane. 1 ly sounds much better. I would think that if there was such a thing it would be a brown dwarf, those are faint. Over half of stars like our Sun have such a companion star, so there is a good chance that we would have one too. I don't know.
[quote]Originally posted by croxis:
[b]
Look at [url="http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/"]http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/[/url] too
[/b][/quote]
Ok, we've got a tiny misunderstanding here.
I am not talking about the mumbo-jumbo doomsday planet X that killed the dinosaurs and will wipe out humanity in 2003. Of course that's hokum.
I'm talking about Percival Lowells Planet X.
He calculated all the wobbles and found some anomalies that couldn't be explained. He concluded that there must be a 9th Planet (this was before Pluto was discoverd).
He called it Planet X. This term has been used for an unknown planet for quite some time. Before it was discovered, Neptune has also been PLanet X.
According to his calculations, Planet X orbits the sun in 282 years and has 7 times the mass of the earth. (That is assuming that there is only 1 missing planet. If the missing mass is devided between multiple objects, of course these figures would change)
In 1905 he started the first systematical search for Planet X. With no success.
1929 Clyde Tombaugh started a new serach for Planet X - and found something: Pluto.
But it soon turned out that Pluto was too small to explain the anomalies in Uranus and Neptunes orbits.
So the search for Planet X continues.
Later the therm Planet X was used in a couple of Si-Fi B-movies and even later a few dubious individuals (who claimed to be in contact with aliens) sayed they knew of an unknown planet that passes near erath every 75 million years (!??!). It is supposed to be responsible for the extinction of the dinosaurs and all the evil in the world yadda-yadda-yadda...
They coose to call it Planet X. Maybe because that name has always been used for an unknown planet, but more likely because they have seen too many B-movies. [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]
So Lowells real Planet X is still to be discoverd.
A brown dwarf might explain the wobbles, but that theory is (AFAIK) not supported by any facts.
A 10th planet (or 11th after Quaoar) is probabayl more likely than a brown dwarf.
[quote]Originally posted by Alex:
[b] I'm talking about Percival Lowells Planet X.
He calculated all the wobbles and found some anomalies that couldn't be explained. He concluded that there must be a 9th Planet (this was before Pluto was discoverd).[/b][/quote]
Those wobbles and such have all been accounted for, he didn't take into consideration (or know) about Neptune and Uranus's high mass, once you calculate for these, no other planets are necessary to explain the planetary orbits.
-------------------
[b]www.aerowebspace.co.uk[/b]
--
Only the insane have strength enough to prosper,
Only those that prosper truly judge what is sane.
[quote]Originally posted by DsDetective:
[b]I fear your planet, and all those who live on it.
[/b][/quote]
Hey, do not mock me, for.. I umm, I am a loyal minnion of Biggles! yes! thats it!
Biggles<font color=#AAFFAA>The Man Without a Face</font>
Good.
------------------
[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
Going by Zacharia Sitchin's work on Sumerian and Babylonian writings, it would appear that this theory of a 10th planet has been around for a LONG time...
The thought of a rogue planet or small star of high mass (Taimut sp?), that comes along every so often in its elongated orbit to effect catastrophic destruction on the rest of the celestial bodies dates back to these times...
It is interesting that this celestial body described by the ancients has a glowing characteristic (glory). Maybe a red/brown dwarf of some kind.
It is also interesting that these same writings seem to indicate that the asteroid belt is the remnant of a completely formed planet that was later destroyed by tidal forces between both Jupiter and this 10th planet at some point in the ancient past.
Zacharia Sitchin's work is a great read (just ask Randy [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img] ) ...even if you don't buy the claims, as it is an insight to the way the ancient civilizations viewed our solar system.
I am constantly amazed at the high level of knowlegde these and other civilizations had about the universe, down to the accuracy of their observations, and their understanding of the dynamics.
Comments
------------------
possibly futile, but very human.
Planet X would have to have aproximately 7 times the mass of the Earth. Pluto has just about 2% of Earths mass. Even Pluto and charon together are still at only 3% of earths mass.
Maybe Quaoar is Planet X. We'll have to wait for data about it's size and mass.
[b]Quaoar is half the mass of Pluto.. [/b][/quote]
It has about half the radius of Pluto. I don't think they know anything about it's mass yet. This usually requires observing the object for an extended period of time.
Of course with this radius (even if it has a very high density) it probably won't have a verry high mass (nowhere near erths mass)
[quote]Originally posted by croxis:
[b]Planet X does not exist. All wobbles are acounted for. [/b][/quote]
You're sure about this? Pluto wasn't nearly enough to explain them, and we didn't discover toom many bodies with considerable mass since then. Not enough to account for Lowells missing 7 earth-masses. (as far as I know Lowells calculations weren't wrong)
[quote]
You're sure about this? Pluto wasn't nearly enough to explain them, and we didn't discover toom many bodies with considerable mass since then. Not enough to account for Lowells missing 7 earth-masses. (as far as I know Lowells calculations weren't wrong)[/quote]
If this is the guy who I think it is... when he first made the claim he forgot to account for Earth's own wobble, so it made it look like everything else is off. I haven't been able to find a website though to back up his claim. As I said, if there is extra wobbling it may be from a companion red or brown dwarf that might be orbiting our sun about 1-3 ly out.
Look at [url="http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/"]http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/[/url] too
[This message has been edited by croxis (edited 10-10-2002).]
[b]As I said, if there is extra wobbling it may be from a companion red or brown dwarf that might be orbiting our sun about 1-3 ly out.[/b][/quote]
1-3 ly ?
That's a tad far, and we should see some serious deviations in Proxima Centauri and the Alpha/Beta Centauri stars orbits... being they are generally 4 Light years distance...
[b]
Look at [url="http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/"]http://www.badastronomy.com/bad/misc/planetx/[/url] too
[/b][/quote]
Ok, we've got a tiny misunderstanding here.
I am not talking about the mumbo-jumbo doomsday planet X that killed the dinosaurs and will wipe out humanity in 2003. Of course that's hokum.
I'm talking about Percival Lowells Planet X.
He calculated all the wobbles and found some anomalies that couldn't be explained. He concluded that there must be a 9th Planet (this was before Pluto was discoverd).
He called it Planet X. This term has been used for an unknown planet for quite some time. Before it was discovered, Neptune has also been PLanet X.
According to his calculations, Planet X orbits the sun in 282 years and has 7 times the mass of the earth. (That is assuming that there is only 1 missing planet. If the missing mass is devided between multiple objects, of course these figures would change)
In 1905 he started the first systematical search for Planet X. With no success.
1929 Clyde Tombaugh started a new serach for Planet X - and found something: Pluto.
But it soon turned out that Pluto was too small to explain the anomalies in Uranus and Neptunes orbits.
So the search for Planet X continues.
Later the therm Planet X was used in a couple of Si-Fi B-movies and even later a few dubious individuals (who claimed to be in contact with aliens) sayed they knew of an unknown planet that passes near erath every 75 million years (!??!). It is supposed to be responsible for the extinction of the dinosaurs and all the evil in the world yadda-yadda-yadda...
They coose to call it Planet X. Maybe because that name has always been used for an unknown planet, but more likely because they have seen too many B-movies. [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]
So Lowells real Planet X is still to be discoverd.
A brown dwarf might explain the wobbles, but that theory is (AFAIK) not supported by any facts.
A 10th planet (or 11th after Quaoar) is probabayl more likely than a brown dwarf.
[b] I'm talking about Percival Lowells Planet X.
He calculated all the wobbles and found some anomalies that couldn't be explained. He concluded that there must be a 9th Planet (this was before Pluto was discoverd).[/b][/quote]
Those wobbles and such have all been accounted for, he didn't take into consideration (or know) about Neptune and Uranus's high mass, once you calculate for these, no other planets are necessary to explain the planetary orbits.
-------------------
[b]www.aerowebspace.co.uk[/b]
--
Only the insane have strength enough to prosper,
Only those that prosper truly judge what is sane.
[b]I fear your planet, and all those who live on it.
[/b][/quote]
Hey, do not mock me, for.. I umm, I am a loyal minnion of Biggles! yes! thats it!
------------------
[url="http://www.minbari.co.uk/log12.2263/"]Never eat anything bigger than your own head.[/url]
"Nonono...Is not [i]Great[/i] Machine. Is...[i]Not[/i]-so-Great Machine. It make good snow cone though." - Zathras
The thought of a rogue planet or small star of high mass (Taimut sp?), that comes along every so often in its elongated orbit to effect catastrophic destruction on the rest of the celestial bodies dates back to these times...
It is interesting that this celestial body described by the ancients has a glowing characteristic (glory). Maybe a red/brown dwarf of some kind.
It is also interesting that these same writings seem to indicate that the asteroid belt is the remnant of a completely formed planet that was later destroyed by tidal forces between both Jupiter and this 10th planet at some point in the ancient past.
Zacharia Sitchin's work is a great read (just ask Randy [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img] ) ...even if you don't buy the claims, as it is an insight to the way the ancient civilizations viewed our solar system.
I am constantly amazed at the high level of knowlegde these and other civilizations had about the universe, down to the accuracy of their observations, and their understanding of the dynamics.
[img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/wink.gif[/img]
[This message has been edited by JackN (edited 10-11-2002).]
Argone
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[b]4 Thousand Throats can be cut in one night by a running Warrior[/b]