Issues with your account? Bug us in the Discord!

Plot Question: Talia, "Control", and the data crystal

VladVlad Earthforce Officer
in Babylon 5
I never saw all the eps of B5 back when it was on broadcast TV, and I haven't had cable in years, so the DVDs are my first time actually seeing the whole series end to end.

I remember seeing "Divided Loyalties" back when it was first on, and I've downloaded it since then to rewatch it. Near the end of the episode, Garabaldi remembers that Talia mentioned the whole incident with Kosh and Abbut, then he goes of to "check on something", presumably related to that. I had always figured that it was explaned in the original episode ("Deathwalker", which I hadn't seen at that point), or was explained later on.

I finally got around to watching Deathwalker on DVD the other day, and it still doesn't make any more sense. I'm guessing that Kosh used Abbut to make a recording of Talia's personality, perhaps to attempt to restore it once Control took over. I've done some skimming through the episode guides at Midwinter.com, but haven't come up with any answers.

What was on the crystal, exactly, and what ended up happening with it?

Comments

  • AlexAlex Earthforce Officer
    Yes, it doesn't make any sense and we'll probabyl never find out.

    It probably was the beginning of an arc that would have been solved later, but was dropped when Andrea Tompson (Tali Winters) left the show and Talia was replaced by Lyta Alexander.
  • croxiscroxis I am the walrus
    I thought Control was just a back door for that character, like all of them had.
  • BekennBekenn Sinclair's Duck
    Control *was* the hidden personality. I believe the data crystal contained Talia's "good" personality, which Kosh recorded for later use, knowing what would eventually happen. As for what happened with it... well, one day he accidentally dropped it down the sink and it disappeared into the station's plumbing, never to be seen again.

    ------------------
    We are here to place President Grenewetzki under arrest!
  • ArgoneArgone Genuine Klingon
    Kosh probably figure her real personallity was worse than the implanted one and threw it away!

    ------------------
    [b]May You Live Forever, and The Last Voice You Hear, Be Mine! [/b]
  • AlexAlex Earthforce Officer
    Lets have a look at the mess that happened with B5's telepath and her story arc:

    In 'The gathering' we have Lyta Alexander, who scans kosh. Somoehow this would eventually give her telepathic super-powers. But Patricia Tallman left before season 1 and Lyta was replaced with Talia.

    Now Talia somehow has to become the 'telepathic doomsday-device'. Enter Jason Ironhart. He is the backdoor for Lyta. The gift he gave Talia becomes stronger and stronger ('Race Through Dark Places'). But JMS also need to establish a connection between her and Kosh/the Vorlons to get her as close as possible to the story that would have been Lyta's. I think thats where the Data Crystal comes in.

    Then Andrea Tompson also leaves the show.
    Now JMS has a problem. He has to introduce a 3rd telepath and a 3rd way to give him/her superpowers. Luckily Patricia Tallman is availible again and so Lyta returns. She can continue her original arc (maybe with some modifications) where she gets the powers from the Vorlons.


    What is control and what is the data Crystal?
    I see 2 possibilities:
    1) Controll is just a way to remove Talia and replace her with Lyta without loosing time. The Telepath story is quite messed up and has to get back on track ASAP.
    This version is supported by the fact that we never heard about control before. If it was planed, it would have been foreshadowed somehow. We would have heard that the Psi-corps can do this, a long time before it happened.
    In this version the Data-crystal would have been used later, probably to establish the Talia-Kosh connection (if Andrea would have stayed) but we don't know how.

    2) Controll was planned. Kosh would have used the crytal to restore Talia's personality. Talia would be in Kosh's debt and would work for him (like Lyta did)


    ...or it's something competely different we don't even romotely think of.
    The ways of the Vorlons are strange, the ways of JMS are stranger [img]http://216.15.145.59/mainforums/smile.gif[/img]

    [This message has been edited by Alex (edited 01-17-2003).]
  • BekennBekenn Sinclair's Duck
    The whole latent personality thing was planned; it was originally going to be a Takashima arc, but was shifted to Talia. That's why we see so much of her looking into a mirror. Control showed up in "A Spider in the Web."

    ------------------
    We are here to place President Grenewetzki under arrest!
  • TyvarTyvar Next best thing to a St. Bernard
    Mmmm And the Crystal could have been used to have a less tragic end to the Talia arc, and to give Ivonova something to do after Marcus'death. "what do you mean there is a way to restore Talias personality?!, this little do-hicky will fix her?, how do I shove it into her head?!" And off goes Ivonova on a crusade.
  • croxiscroxis I am the walrus
    Wow, that makes sence. GRRR why did she have to leave then!

    *sigh*
  • eamonmcaeamonmca Earthforce Officer
    Kosh might have wanted to analyse the technology the PSiCorp have in mind control, or just a Loyal PSiCorp personality, for obvious reasons.
    ie: A piece of himself running around in Lyta, under their jurisdiction.
    The high probability of the shadows allying themselves with the Corp and being a threat.

    Simple, selfish, obscure and infathomable intelligence gathering.
    Typical Vorlon stuff.
  • eamonmcaeamonmca Earthforce Officer
    Even more typical selfish vorlon stuff, would be to have this ability, and hence be able to get Ivanova to do ANYTHING Kosh wanted.

    And we all know how dangerous Ivanova on a [b]mission[/b] can be...

    [This message has been edited by eamonmca (edited 01-24-2003).]
Sign In or Register to comment.